[Eorzea]

I see a lot of people talking about taking Thaumaturge to level 16 solely for this skill.

Stygian Spikes description said:

Armors party members within area of effect with umbral spikes, granting the ability to absorb MP from attacking enemies.

My questions:

• Is it really that effective when used by a class other than Thaumaturge?
  
• I know the recast time is 60 seconds, but what is its duration?

[Takhimar]

I can't answer your question about Stygian Spikes in particular, but I do know that the level 10 ability for THM, Punishing Barbs, works exceptionally well on a physical class.

I would imagine that such defensive spells would be even MORE effective on another class than on a magic class, due to higher HP and defense. Punising Barbs works that way. On my pugilist I have ~900hp, as opposed to my thaumaturge's 500. That allows far greater leeway when you are taking damage, which is when such abilities come into effect.

I have yet to see any particular defect when using a magical ability on a physical class (apart from no AoE spells).

Edit: By the way, even if you don't take THM to 16, at least get it to 10 for punishing barbs, it is a 3 minute cooldown ability that does damage to the opponent equal to what you take. Which makes soloing red monsters quite easy.

This post has been edited by Takhimar: Sep 29, 2010 - 8:22 AM

[pogiman]

From what i have heard from those on beta that leveled to get this ability it is worth it. I personally have not leveled my thm that high but i know shock spikes is wonderful for every class in the game. Not sure if it stacks with the punishing barbs but if it does you can just stand back and watch mobs die just from hitting you lol.

[Inaaca]

I wouldn't rush into Thaumaturge just for this ability alone. It's likely going to get nerfed soon if it's as powerful as it sounds.

[Dalkor]

I agree with inaaca, Punishing Barbs is just way to powerful an ability, even with a three minute cooldown. Rampart would have to make me invincible to get the same effectiveness out of it comparatively (Rampart is a FIVE minute cooldown).

[pogiman]

If barbs is the reason you are kililng a mob then there is a 99% chance you are going to die with them. If someone wants to have to repair their gear a million times let them. I have a feeling this abiliy is meant to help tanks hold threat on big boss fights as they will be able to dump a bunch of damage in the first few seconds of the fight so the poor lancers and pugs dont get owned lol.

[Dalkor]

Remember that Leve we did earlier this week Pogi? (this is Rhyno) we died about 11 times on those footpads, my gear didnt take any extra durability damage...


Also Pugs are tanks I am not leveling up my magic classes, I would rather use my other abilities than punishing barbs =/ Gladiator's GM abilities generate extra threat so I hope I don't have to depend on one ability from THM just so I can start tanking.

[Takhimar]

pogiman, on Oct 5, 2010 - 11:51 AM, said:

If barbs is the reason you are kililng a mob then there is a 99% chance you are going to die with them. If someone wants to have to repair their gear a million times let them. I have a feeling this abiliy is meant to help tanks hold threat on big boss fights as they will be able to dump a bunch of damage in the first few seconds of the fight so the poor lancers and pugs dont get owned lol.

This isn't how it works in my experience.

Please get it and try it yourself.

That said, it may help tanks hold threat, but given the number of tools when compared to FFXI, (off the top of my head, Gladiators have 3) tanks shouldn't need to use this ability to help themselves.

On topic: Stygian spikes. I have had the spell cast on my several times, and it seems to add a little MP every time you are hit. I am sure you are familiar with Damnation, or Radiance. They are an inaccurate TP based ability that you use to restore mana. Stygian spikes may restore less, but since you don't have to use it 4 times to hit once, it gives much more MP. You do have to get hit though.

I have not had the chance to see if it gives you MP through stoneskin.

This post has been edited by Takhimar: Oct 6, 2010 - 7:27 AM

[pogiman]

I do have it and I have tried it out thanks Tak but every time im in a group and we "need" to use it we are dieing anyway. sure if you are fighting someting just barly out of your reach you wont but if you are fighting something away above you you will die most of the time.

[Takhimar]

pogiman, on Oct 6, 2010 - 8:57 AM, said:

I do have it and I have tried it out thanks Tak but every time im in a group and we "need" to use it we are dieing anyway. sure if you are fighting someting just barly out of your reach you wont but if you are fighting something away above you you will die most of the time.

My mistake then.

In my experience with it in groups, it allows us to slay higher level mobs easily, if for instance we have a couple of people weakened, or challenge what would normally be an unbeatable mob. I can't say that I usually die when I use it. I usually survive, in fact. Perhaps I have simply been lucky so far.

Why would you be fighting something way above you anyway? I have done so, simply to check what the current limit of what punishing barbs will reflect is. (Followed shortly by my death animation.)

[pogiman]

usually its a mistake lol as someone sets too many stars on a 20 leve and we want to complete it so they can get their Marks so we resort to using barbs suicides...

[Dyft]

It is actually really funny that I stumbled across this thread as I was about to start working on a guide. The reason that I find this funny is that *I* honestly feel that Stygian Spikes is a MUST HAVE skill. It has got to be one of the BEST abilities in the game that I have unlocked so far if not THE best. No matter what job I am playing I have SS loaded up. It lasts about 3 minutes when used on a class other than Theurg (at least for me). Since I am still planning on working on the guide here shortly, I will just cover the highlights of this amazing skill.

Stygian Spikes, The Spell, The Myth, The Legend.

Stygian Spikes is a buff that will provide MP regen whenever damage is taken while the buff is active. First and formost I am going to state that I have not done any in depth testing and number crunching on SS due to how powerfull the spell is. In other words, I don't care enough to test out all the fine details as I am going to be using it anyways.

When you have Stygian Spikes active and take damage (physical for sure, havent tested in depth with magic hits) you will regain somewhere in the ballpark of 10% of the damage in the form of MP. So generally speaking, when I get hit for ~80 dmg I receive ~8 MP. This spell is amazing as it will give you the ability to literally go non stop killing / nuking / debuffing without running out of MP provided that you are the one taking the hits. I use the skill on EVERY Job I play as it allows me to grind mobs when my leves are all on cooldown without ever having to go to a stone or use expendables to regain MP. Even when used by a job that is not theurg, it still returns more MP needed to keep yourself at full life with Cures / Sacrifices. This skill is even more devistating when combined with skills from other classes. I will use my Lancer for this scenario.

Lancer W/ Stygian Spikes Scenario:
I will fire up the Lancer skill (name eludes me at the moment, but its the one that you get at level 10 and makes you attack faster and works as a drain samba also). I will then fire up SS and I'm ready to rock. I usually perfer to pull with Bio or Dia depending on what I am fighting. Once the pull is made I will generally pound a rain check into the perverbial arse of whatever it is that just got pulled. During the fight I may need to cast a cure or two to keep my HP topped off while the Lancer only skill helps keep my HP up as well. All MP used from casting SS, Dia/Bio, and Cures has been returned to me from SS by the end of the fight.

End State: Full MP Full HP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: Full MP Full HP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: Full MP Full HP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: Full MP Full HP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.


Lancer Before Stygian Spikes.
I would fire up the same level 10 lancer skill. I would then skip dia/bio (again depends on the enemy) to perserve MP. During the fight I might need 2-3 Cures depending on how hard of a enemy I was fighting.

End State: ~80-90HP ~70-80MP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: ~65-80HP ~55-70MP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: ~40-65HP ~35-55MP +SP +XP and Ready to pull another.
End State: ~20-40HP ~10-35MP +SP +XP and Need to regen HP / MP via expendables or a stone.


tl;dr
In a game where MP does not come back on it's own at all, a skill that will net you more MP than used per fight is better then pretty much any other skill. The only thing I value more than SS is Cure(or Sacrifice, however personally I perfer Cure).

[Eorzea]

After having played the game for a few months now, I must say that I agree with what you're saying completely. Stygian Spikes is extremely valuable when used by any class that gets hit a lot. For example, if I choose to solo as a Puglist I have practically zero downtime. I like to alternate between this and Shock Spikes as needed.